All boys to men

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All boys to men

Postby MMM » Wed Nov 14, 2012 8:22 am

Hi,

We had a family gathering to catch this movie over the hols. All the boys in the family (ranging from the eldest who will be enlisted next year to the ones who are still in primary school).

The beginning part was rather scary and appeared real to my P1 dd. She asked if some of the landmarks in Singapore are now gone??? She looked rather concerned if that is the real situation outside the cinema. It was real to her as those are the merlion, MBS, CBD, the HDB flats, Singapore flyer, etc....

The young boys were less thrilled.... My ds for one is not very keen on NS after seeing that movie. He asked if it is possible for him not to do NS. I told him that I don't think I will behave like the mother (Irene Ang) in the movie who "geng" how to get the son out of NS.

The men in the house who has been through NS said yes, what they depict in the movie is real or maybe more "tamed down" version of what they encountered. But those "tekan" stuff were true. The men can associate with the movie.

The young girls were like "Heng ah" we don't need to go to NS. For me as a mum, yes I've my concerns. Like will my son be tekan by "men" slightly older than themselves and probably not that much mature? What rights do they have to treat my "little" boy like that :wink: Most importantly, ds must be able to survive NS and stay alive (after hearing all the sudden death in NS... that freaks me out).

MMM
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Re: All boys to men

Postby Joule » Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:01 am

I was a BMT instructor. Let me answer your qn. It's been a long time though.

Like will my son be tekan by "men" slightly older than themselves and probably not that much mature?

Yes. However, things are getting better (should have become better) At that time (late 90s) BMTC was having a revamp and there were strict guidelines, e.g. no more than 20 pushups per session, etc. Instructors can get complained on and pau toh and there would be hell to pay (actually....extra guard duty over weekends). no one wants to risk that so we generally should be strict but fair.

Of course, there are some psycho instructors that CAN do that but those are few. Remember, recruits have a phone number to call to bust us. now should be ok. Example: a 3sg would typically be about 1-1.5 yrs older than the recruit. normally we punish in the context of - e.g. platoon arrive late , 20 pushups, maybe we restart from zero, then make it 40. reasons for tekan - late, being ill discliplined, not moving together as a platoon, general attitude of slackness, etc etc.

generally sergeants also not very mature also but they just need to get the job done (complete day's training) and go back and sleep. why tekan for what?

What rights do they have to treat my "little" boy like that
Most importantly, ds must be able to survive NS and stay alive (after hearing all the sudden death in NS... that freaks me out).


oh dear! survive NS? that sports school fella was just sway lor. a lot of the deaths I've heard of in ns are just misfortune. E.g. go taiwan, platoon mate contracted pneumonia and subsequently died / go taiwan again, fighter jet crash into army base / sway sway kena asthma attack due to smoke grenade..... / 3 tonner got accident / etc etc. There have been cases where I heard about when recruit cannot mentally adapt to the NS life and tried stupid things like eating his camouflage stick or swimming out of Tekong.

There are also some garang kids also who don't know their limits, try to go on runs or strenous exercises when sick because they want to make it into OCS. Those kids are a big danger to themselves! So please, tell your son to be smart, don't be gung ho, if sick, just report sick. This would increase the chance of him surviving NS by a few percentage points.

Joule
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Re: All boys to men

Postby ChiefKiasu » Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:40 pm

Go Uni study also kanna tekkan by evil lecturers who set hard hard questions.
Go do Phd also kanna tekkan by jealous professors who want to wring every drop of blood from their graduate students.
Go work also kanna tekkan by terrible bosses who think you are there to lick their boots.

Really. NS actually not so bad (once you get used to it). At the end of the day, can still become good buddies with all those that tekkan you.

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Re: All boys to men

Postby MMM » Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:48 pm

ChiefKiasu wrote: At the end of the day, can still become good buddies with all those that tekkan you.


Bil related to me after the show that he was a local sergeant. So meaning take corporal $ (the bo huay type of job to hold). He said he tekkan those people during army... He is a insurance agent so it's like payback time for him as no one wants to give him biz.... So those who tekkan people, pls think twice :evil: Never know who will become your boss.

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Re: All boys to men

Postby MMM » Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:49 pm

Joule wrote:I was a BMT instructor. Let me answer your qn. It's been a long time though.


Very interesting :wink:

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Re: All boys to men

Postby Joule » Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:29 pm

MMM wrote:
Joule wrote:I was a BMT instructor. Let me answer your qn. It's been a long time though.


Very interesting :wink:


maybe you can just ask what is the part your son is most worried about

I don't think I would be catching that show. maybe during CNY next yr if it shows on TV. but then again, I don't have a TV at home = )

Joule
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Re: All boys to men

Postby Gooby » Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:49 pm

I watched the show last week. Very funny :smile:

But didn't like it that it is broken up into part 1 and part 2. They are going to screen part 2 during CNY next year.

Gooby
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Re: All boys to men

Postby bupashu » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:37 pm

By Goh Chin Lian

Defence Minister Ng Eng Hen today outlined the actions taken following the deaths of two full-time national servicemen earlier this year, citing the clear breaches of training safety regulations in both incidents.

A Commanding Officer has since been replaced and six other commanders redeployed for the regulations contravened under their watch, even as investigations are ongoing to see if they should be prosecuted in the military or civil courts.

The army's safety processes will also be reviewed by a board chaired by a senior civil servant outside the Defence Ministry, and an inspectorate reporting to the Chief of Defence Force set up to ensure the safety culture of the whole Singapore Armed Forces.

Dr Ng also revealed in a ministerial statement to Parliament the details of the Committees of Inquiry (COI) into the deaths of Private Dominique Sarron Lee Rui Feng, 21, on April 17 and Third Sergeant Tan Mou Sheng, 20, on May 11

http://www.straitstimes.com/microsites/ ... d-20121114
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Re: All boys to men

Postby bupashu » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:19 pm

SINGAPORE: Findings from the Committees of Inquiry (COI) convened after the deaths of two full-time National Servicemen in two separate incidents this year have uncovered clear breaches of training safety regulations.

Defence Minister Ng Eng Hen revealed this in a ministerial statement in Parliament on Wednesday.

In the first incident, Private Dominique Lee died after a training exercise involving smoke grenades at Lim Chu Kang on 17 April.

Private Lee experienced breathing difficulties after exposure from the smoke. He lost consciousness and was later pronounced dead at the National University Hospital.

"The cause of death was certified by the forensic pathologist of the Health Sciences Authority to be due to an 'acute allergic reaction to zinc chloride due to inhalation of zinc chloride fumes'," said Dr Ng.

Zinc chloride is a primary component of smoke grenades currently used in the Singapore Armed Forces (SAF).

The COI discovered that the number of smoke grenades used in the exercise had exceeded the limit specified in training safety regulations.

Based on the exercise layout, not more than two smoke grenades should have been used.

The Platoon Commander threw six grenades, despite being aware of the specific safety regulations.

Dr Ng said that such smoke grenades, which have been used by the SAF since the 1970s, are still safe to use if training safety regulations are observed.

The COI was also "unable to establish with certainty" whether Private's Lee's asthma condition had contributed to his death, saying that the effects of zinc chloride on asthmatics were not well documented in medical literature.

However to address public concerns, the SAF has since suspended the use of such smoke grenades for training but it continues to use them in missions, said the minister.

Dr Ng also said that the SAF's medical classification guidelines on asthma are "relevant, up to date and in line with national and international standards" and stated that it is still safe for servicemen with a history of asthma to undergo training with smoke grenades if training service regulations are followed.

One in five national servicemen is affected by asthma.

MINDEF has relieved both the exercise Chief Safety Officer Captain Chia Thye Siong and the Platoon Commander who threw the smoke grenades, Captain Najib Hanuk Bin Muhamad Jalal, of their duties, the minister said.

They have been re-deployed to assignments which do not oversee soldiers in training or operations.

In the second incident, Third Sergeant Tan Mou Sheng was killed after a jeep that he was in overturned on May 11.

Third Sergeant Tan was travelling with other instructors in a scout jeep and was seated at the rear of the jeep. When the jeep overturned, Third Sergeant Tan was thrown out and pinned under the vehicle.

He underwent emergency surgery at Khoo Teck Puat Hospital but succumbed to his injuries.

Dr Ng said the inquiry discovered that the jeep driver was not licenced to drive the vehicle and that the two rear passengers, one of whom was Third Sergeant Tan, were not wearing their helmets or lap belts.

The COI also found that the Combat Intelligence School had a "weak safety structure" and in the course of its investigations, found other instances of unlicenced driving.

Shortly after the incident, MINDEF removed the Commanding Officer of the Combat Intelligence School Lieutenant-Colonel Vincent Lam Fei Liong from his command.

Other personnel in the Combat Intelligence School that were relieved of their duties include the Head of the Reconnaissance, Surveillance, and Target Acquisition Wing Major Poon Chen Song, the School Sergeant Major 1st Warrant Officer Lim Ser Wei, the exercise Supervising Officer Lieutenant Marcus Koh Men, and the exercise Conducting Officer Master Sergeant Lee Kong Kean.

Vehicular management systems at all SAF units have since been tightened to ensure no unauthorised driving occurs during field training.

COIs are chaired by senior civil servants from outside MINDEF and members include one or two medical specialists.

Dr Ng told the House that personnel found negligent in both incidents could be subject to a General Court Martial.

Police investigations are also on-going to determine whether to prosecute the personnel involved in Civil Court.

"Any commander who ignores safety regulations, whether wilfully or negligently, puts his soldiers at risk and is not fit for command," said Dr Ng.

"Our soldiers can train realistically and safely - there need not be a compromise…These two deaths could have been avoided if safety instructions had been followed".

Dr Ng also told Parliament that after these two incidents, the Singapore Armed Forces will make three key systemic changes to strengthen training safety.

Under the changes, the SAF will deploy more safety officers on the ground.

A Safety Review Board has also been set up to review the Army's overall safety structure, processes and culture.

In addition, the SAF will set up an Inspectorate, reporting directly to the Chief of Defence Force.

Read the ministerial statement by Dr Ng Eng Hen

- CNA/jc

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/ ... 75/1/.html
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Re: All boys to men

Postby Nebbermind » Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:32 pm

Do they still go thru chemical warfare?
Now, with the knowledge of 'acute allergic reaction', it's actually more scary than I ever thought.

Nebbermind
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