All About Taekwondo

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Serendipity
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by Serendipity » Thu Jun 27, 2019 9:23 pm

Lanzhou wrote:
Thu Jun 27, 2019 9:17 pm
My son’s belt upgrades are free. A new tip or belt is only given when the coach thinks the child has progressed enough to earn it. It took my son’s class one year before any of them progressed to a yellow belt. The teachers see what level the child’s at so in my opinion there’s no reason to be charging fees for belt upgrades, and definitely not for frequent belt upgrades.

If a martial arts place has a high turnover of students, then what does that say about them? My child’s gym hasn’t lost a single student in the year he’s been there; the only kids who disappear from his class are the ones who have progressed to the older kids group.
:? I don't think the TKD schools charge for belts but we do need to pay fees for the STF grading tests, don't we? I thought it's standard across all schools.

Lanzhou
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by Lanzhou » Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:51 am

Just another way to earn money. TKD seems to be a belt factory wherever you go though so it’s unavoidable. I guess I was comparing it to those martial arts where upgrading to higher belts is less frequent, with fewer belts, and much harder to progress because they’re not designed to make extra money from parents and students.

How many belt levels does a child need? In Japan, children who do judo are never even given a belt beyond white and judo is the martial art that invented the coloured belt system.

peasants
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by peasants » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:37 am

Not sure what is your point here. So what if there is a belt system or if there isn't. Also, we are not talking about belts being chargable here at the first place. Do you even know what is the use of belt colors? Answer is not about who's higher or so called belt factory.

I don't even see the correlation between tkd and judo here.

Lanzhou
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by Lanzhou » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:42 am

Point is that the belt system can be abused to make money for the business rather than the needs of the student. Serendipity wrote that more levels have been recently introduced and those have to be paid for, and Chiefkiasu said of courise it’s a cash grab. I’m just agreeing,

Nothing wrong with a martial arts system with lots of levels of belts per se. When they have to pay for frequent tests to upgrade (like recently invented additional tests) then one can ask themselves if all those chargeable tests are actually needed, and indeed whether they might be in a McDojo.

Coloured belts and levels aren’t some ancient system. They were invented in the 20th century under judo, the system was then adopted by some martial arts but not all. Highly effective martial arts like boxing, wrestling, Muay Thai, kickboxing, MMA and sambo don’t have any belt system and they produce high quality students. Effective martial arts like jujitsu and judo have belts but they’re not frequently upgrading and so the there’s no profit motive behind it; getting to a Brazilian jujitsu black belt is really hard and takes many years to attain without having to pay a lot to get there.

peasants
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by peasants » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:04 am

I see. Complicated belt system and profit driven are your main concerns which does not produce effective students. So what is consider effective? Mind sharing?


Lanzhou
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by Lanzhou » Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:28 pm

No problem with a place aiming to make a profit, or having whatever belt system it wants. Brazilian jujitsu is profit-driven and produces world class ground fighters; wrestling isn’t profit driven and also produces world class ground and standing fighters. One has a belt system, the other doesn’t.

It’s only when an unnecessarily complex belt/ranking system develops with the real purpose of just extracting extra money that I think it’s worth thinking about. I’m not saying all TKD places are exploiting their students, but a number of them always are.

But many parents and students don’t have much knowledge about martial arts in general so their first question is “how long will it be until my child becomes a black belt?”, rather than “how effective is this martial art for (self defence/ athleticism/ aesthetically-pleasing/ whatever reason they’re looking for)? What proof is there? How long does it usually take until we reach it?”). My son did a trial lesson in a McDojo and I don’t think most of the parents there really care; they feel good and have a black belt and that’s probably their main criteria. The McDojo never enter competitions or even allow sparring, so they won’t know how much they lack in skill and ability, but that doesn’t stop the place constantly charging extra for tests for constantly extra levels.

peasants
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by peasants » Sat Jun 29, 2019 2:25 pm

Lol. Now I fully agree with you. Especially on TKD, which itself has more than one school of art here.

DavidFhu
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by DavidFhu » Sat Jul 20, 2019 4:34 pm

Serendipity wrote:
Thu Jun 27, 2019 9:23 pm
Lanzhou wrote:
Thu Jun 27, 2019 9:17 pm
My son’s belt upgrades are free. A new tip or belt is only given when the coach thinks the child has progressed enough to earn it. It took my son’s class one year before any of them progressed to a yellow belt. The teachers see what level the child’s at so in my opinion there’s no reason to be charging fees for belt upgrades, and definitely not for frequent belt upgrades.

If a martial arts place has a high turnover of students, then what does that say about them? My child’s gym hasn’t lost a single student in the year he’s been there; the only kids who disappear from his class are the ones who have progressed to the older kids group.
:? I don't think the TKD schools charge for belts but we do need to pay fees for the STF grading tests, don't we? I thought it's standard across all schools.
It depend on different training club. Some of the clubs used selling for equipment, belt and uniform to make extra, as training fee is as low as $50 for 3 months.

Some clubs charge training $100 - 200+ per month, with or without extra income make very little difference.

As for grading, there is a difference between club own grading or centralized grading. Normally club own grading is more expensive compared to centralize grading.

DavidFhu
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by DavidFhu » Sat Jul 20, 2019 4:50 pm

ChiefKiasu wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:00 pm
Serendipity wrote:
Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:29 am
Yeah, now there are more grading levels to clear... I half-jokingly tell my friends that this is a way to earn more of our :moneyflies:
Half jokingly? That's the exact reason why they increased the grading levels. They find that lots of kids drop out before reaching the lowest belts and it was too easy to reach black belt if you stay for at most a couple of years!
I felt that the comment is an injustice to people who set the process.

http://www.stf.sg/grading/1571-new-grading-system

The 3 foundation levels for participants (12 years old and below) and an intermediate poom belt stage for juniors (15 years old and below)

Is there a possibility for double promotion?

Yes, candidates who do reasonably well in Foundation 3 will be given double promotion.

Just read more from the website. If the kids below 12, yet can fulfil the requirement, I don't see why the coach cannot ask for a double or triple promotion from the examiner.

It is unfair to make any comments without understanding the sports.

DavidFhu
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Re: All About Taekwondo

Post by DavidFhu » Sat Jul 20, 2019 5:15 pm

peasants wrote:
Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:54 am
DavidFhu wrote:
peasants wrote:Any parents learning tkd?
Hi,

I am learning TKD. What can I help?
Hi David,

Are you under STF or STA? Actually, I am a black tip at STF 5 or 6 years ago when I left the training. Wondering how I should make a return.
Hi Peasants,

I am under STF. I wish to move to ITF, but my son already at the black tip at STF. Need to wait till he is poom belt before doing a conversion. And ITF trainers and clubs are lesser compare to WTF.

If you are a black tip with a club, you may go back to your club to ask for your grading card. Hopefully, they did not dump it once you stop paying them.

I have my blue belt during my NS time, due to unable to found my trainer, I had to start all over again.

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