Discipline

[PsMom]

OK. So not exactly an Academic Question. More about Discipline. DS is Sec 3. He helped a friend cheat in class test and the other guy ratted him out. Not just that, DS went and told to other kids about the questions on the test ( they were going to take the same test in second session).
An incidence report was made and he got a 0 on that test. He was told his conduct was poorly and he would get a grade lower on his conduct on his final report card. All good.
2 Days ago , we get a call from discipline master to come talk to them about this. Not knowing what to expect ( we thought the matter was closed). We went to school today. They told us about this. They told us they are suspending him for a day , asking him to seek counseling and the lower grade on conduct and 0 on the test. We were all good till then. Then they said they are stripping him off of his captaincy of the school football team !!! DS is passionate about the game and they know this will hurt - bad !! And he deserves to be the captain , he got it through sheer hard work. HE is an excellent student too, but he is ok with the 0 on one test in his life. But this one.. I worry this might drive him to do something bad, maybe harm himself.
I want to ask in this forum, with due respect to all members, what is your experience of a 'punishment' for such an offence? Do you think the student leaders are stripped off of their leadership positions for such 'crimes' ? Also, do you think a one time visit with counselor is enough to take care of scars this would leave?
Any thought on how to proceed on this are welcome !!

[Liew Nga Wing]

Do you think the student leaders are stripped off of their leadership positions for such 'crimes' ? Also, do you think a one time visit with counselor is enough to take care of scars this would leave?
Any thought on how to proceed on this are welcome !!

Hi PsMom,
It is a question of how you define the word " Integrity" and "Cheating ". To me, "Cheating" is a serious offence and as a captain or a leader, there are some essential or basic requirements on their personality and Integrity is a MUST.

I am very sorry to say that, but I have been working for the Government more than twenty four years and we know there is 0 tolerance of any form of cheating in our working place and I experienced a few colleagues were terminated on spot because of some forms of dishonest behaviour.

How to lead a group or how the other classmates will listen to a captain or leader when they know the captain/leader may cheat?

Since what has happened had happened, just ask your DS to take it as a lesson and never never commit any dishonest behaviour again.

If the counsellor think that your DS need more counselling, he/she may arrange another visit for your DS.

I understand the scars on your DS cannot be disappeared tomorrow, but we can look at it from another angle, your DS has learnt the serious consequences of cheating and he will NOT do it again for the rest of his life.

[zac's mum]

I agree with LNW above. It is a major offence in any school or organization’s rule book (see example here: https://teckwhyesec.moe.edu.sg/students ... -offences/)

More importantly consider it a chance to reflect on why it was morally wrong of him to do so (u do not seem to have emphasized this to him). Correct it now before adulthood please. Look at the ones named & shamed for cheating in the bar exam. I wouldnt trust them with my money anytime.

[00skyblue00]

Nowadays, in sec school, there are weighted assessment which are take home work. Wonder if school fully explains what students can and cannot do and the differences among, tests/exams, take home work and project work which are weighted. Will teenagers get mixed up?
In our era, we do not have so many different types of assessment.

[Imp75]

I am not working in a school but while cheating is undesirable, I am always under the impression that school is a forgiving place and a place where you can afford to make mistakes, learn and move on being a better person. I don't think we should equate it to a workplace or external envnmt where there are no second chances.
In this case, he did not cheat per se. He was just being ignorant of the consequences of revealing the exam questions/answers to his friends. It could be done in jest, it could be done for various reasons (ask him) .Ultimately he did not benefit at all so why should the punishment be so harsh. I think what you can do here is to appeal to the school not to remove his captaincy as it meant the world to him and to show his remorse, perhaps get your son to acknowledge his "moment of folly" in a heartfelt letter, promise nvr to do again and to accept any other forms of punishment that would be meted out. Good luck in your appeal.

[PsMom]

Hi PsMom,
It is a question of how you define the word " Integrity" and "Cheating ". To me, "Cheating" is a serious offence and as a captain or a leader, there are some essential or basic requirements on their personality and Integrity is a MUST.

I am very sorry to say that, but I have been working for the Government more than twenty four years and we know there is 0 tolerance of any form of cheating in our working place and I experienced a few colleagues were terminated on spot because of some forms of dishonest behaviour.

How to lead a group or how the other classmates will listen to a captain or leader when they know the captain/leader may cheat?

Since what has happened had happened, just ask your DS to take it as a lesson and never never commit any dishonest behaviour again.

If the counsellor think that your DS need more counselling, he/she may arrange another visit for your DS.

I understand the scars on your DS cannot be disappeared tomorrow, but we can look at it from another angle, your DS has learnt the serious consequences of cheating and he will NOT do it again for the rest of his life.

Govt service for 24 years ? How can you compare a 15 year old to a 40 year old ? Does adulthood equate to teenage? Then why are the teenagers made out to be such a big deal? Why have the psychologists written books about how to deal with them? And a job in public eye where you are being paid public money for your salary, is same as a captain of a small school team? How can you compare the punishment from one to another?
Is this how we deal with people in one of the most sensitive stages of their lives? Has pandemic tauught us nothing? What happened at River Valley school was a first of its kind, in Singapore, right? Why did it happen? Doesn't looks like anyone learnt anything from the event, just suppressed it as a one time thing?

[Liew Nga Wing]

Cheating is an offence, for whatever reasons behind, it is Wrong. The boy is given chances as the school is not kicking him out of the school, he can continue his study but only remove his captaincy. The school has to do so to "kill one to warn a hundred" - to emphasis to all students - Cheating is not acceptable.

In my opinion, if the parents appeal to the school - showing the parents are not aware the important of Integrity and unwilling to admit the serious of their kids misconduct.

[PsMom]

I agree with LNW above. It is a major offence in any school or organization’s rule book (see example here: https://teckwhyesec.moe.edu.sg/students ... -offences/)

More importantly consider it a chance to reflect on why it was morally wrong of him to do so (u do not seem to have emphasized this to him). Correct it now before adulthood please. Look at the ones named & shamed for cheating in the bar exam. I wouldnt trust them with my money anytime.

Please. I didnt ask for a judgement on my parenting style so keep your opinions about what I said to him or emphasized to him, to yourself .
I thought this was a safe community to come and ask questions. I was not asking for opinions on parenting. A one time mistake does not make a child bad and a parent useless. Second chances are fair, specially when the offender does not even fully understand the consequence of what they did. Like another mom said here, Schools are supposed to be 'safe' places. They certainly are the ones to be used as weapons to kill the kid's spirit to live or scar them forver.

[zac's mum]

Your son has leadership potential. What he chooses to do with those leadership skills is important to society isnt it? Lead others to do bad or do good?

There is no honor or respect for a soccer team if they win thru eg match fixing or dubious means. I hope he can learn that respect and admiration from others can be earned thru good ways. He doesnt have to resort to leaking qns.

[PsMom]

Cheating is an offence, for whatever reasons behind, it is Wrong. The boy is given chances as the school is not kicking him out of the school, he can continue his study but only remove his captaincy. The school has to do so to "kill one to warn a hundred" - to emphasis to all students - Cheating is not acceptable.

In my opinion, if the parents appeal to the school - showing the parents are not aware the important of Integrity and unwilling to admit the serious of their kids misconduct.

Cheating is wrong and he was punished in multiple ways- by downgrading his grade for conduct, by suspension and by getting 0 on exam he cheated on. Stripping him of captaincy sounds like a 'revenge' seeking to me. I wonder if someone else would have been given a lighter slap on wrist like detention, community service or such for a first time offence . No warning?? No counseling? Straight Stripping of leadership? Does that happen in your office? Employees straight away fired and shamed? Not even a warning ?