My son is an average student in his studies and I'm fine with that. I want him to enjoy his childhood and not bury himself in studies.
As such, I want to pinpoint the weak areas of his work. So far I manage to get right in his English and Chinese.
For his maths, I have pinpointed that his weak area is in word problems, ie. Section C.
You see, he can consistently score 70%+ in Section A, consistently score 60%+ in Section B, but score as low as ZERO for Section C!!!!
I have narrowed down the problem itself and it is aligned with what the teachers has told me: My son is weak in model diagram.
For some reasons, he cannot visualize the word problems into diagrams. And, his logical deduction of problems in math is very weak too.
All I need to do to enable him to visualize the problems, do you have any recommendations?
Help with model maths for P4 child
Academic support for Primary 4

nkthen  OrangeBelt
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by acforfamily » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:34 pm
Have you tried asking him to break up the questions into parts first? He could be stumped by the mass of words and does not know where to start.

acforfamily  BlueBelt
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by Guest » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:37 pm
Actually it starts by understanding the question. If the question cannot be understood, it would be hard to interpret it into a diagram.
 Guest
Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by CoffeeCat » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:24 am
nkthen wrote:You see, he can consistently score 70%+ in Section A, consistently score 60%+ in Section B, but score as low as ZERO for Section C!!!!
consistently scored 70+ and 60+? are the marks loss due to carelessness or simply lack of practise?
Without any clearer information, this gives the impression that he might be weak in maths.
nkthen wrote:For some reasons, he cannot visualize the word problems into diagrams. And, his logical deduction of problems in math is very weak too.
Once again without any further information, I m inclined to think that his inability to visualize the word problems into diagrams has something to do with his weak deduction skills.
When u mention visualizing, you are looking at the process of translating the information given in a question to a model diagram. This may requires some logical deduction.

CoffeeCat  BrownBelt
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by nkthen » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:39 am
CoffeeCat wrote:nkthen wrote:You see, he can consistently score 70%+ in Section A, consistently score 60%+ in Section B, but score as low as ZERO for Section C!!!!
consistently scored 70+ and 60+? are the marks loss due to carelessness or simply lack of practise?
Without any clearer information, this gives the impression that he might be weak in maths.nkthen wrote:For some reasons, he cannot visualize the word problems into diagrams. And, his logical deduction of problems in math is very weak too.
Once again without any further information, I m inclined to think that his inability to visualize the word problems into diagrams has something to do with his weak deduction skills.
When u mention visualizing, you are looking at the process of translating the information given in a question to a model diagram. This may requires some logical deduction.
OK, to clarify, when it comes to simple, direct maths questions, he can answer most of them. They are mostly found in Section A and B. Section C is the one that he finds it hard to do. We have practiced many times but he still have problems doing the very first step, which is to draw the model.

nkthen  OrangeBelt
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by Pen88n » Thu Jun 09, 2011 1:21 am
I would deduce from your post that your son actually simply do not understand the problem sum question and is unable to extract the required information to even take the 1st step to draw the model.
Instead of continuing to coach him on the P4 problem sums that require more complex model drawing, what you can do is to start from square 1 for model drawing and add on from there:
1. Pull out the simple problem sums and make him do the model drawing from there. These can be just using simple +x/ computation only.
2. If he is able to do so, start putting in additional info (more numbers) into the simple problem sums slowly. He will have to change / redraw his model to reflect this new info.
3. Move on to teach him additional modelling skills, such as "equalise" the parts, etc.
You can move thru' step 1 and 2 very quickly if you find his foundation ok. From step 3 onwards, it will require you to learn and understand the concepts before you can find the best way to put thru' to him.
Hope this helps.
Instead of continuing to coach him on the P4 problem sums that require more complex model drawing, what you can do is to start from square 1 for model drawing and add on from there:
1. Pull out the simple problem sums and make him do the model drawing from there. These can be just using simple +x/ computation only.
2. If he is able to do so, start putting in additional info (more numbers) into the simple problem sums slowly. He will have to change / redraw his model to reflect this new info.
3. Move on to teach him additional modelling skills, such as "equalise" the parts, etc.
You can move thru' step 1 and 2 very quickly if you find his foundation ok. From step 3 onwards, it will require you to learn and understand the concepts before you can find the best way to put thru' to him.
Hope this helps.

Pen88n  KiasuGrandMaster
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by PiggyLalala » Thu Jun 09, 2011 9:11 am
In such cases, I would think that the child cannot understand the teacher's teaching. It could be the teacher is too fast in her teaching or her teaching method does not suit the child. Maybe getting a good tutor and have a one to one tuition with the child will help the child to understand the concepts better. But where to find good tutor?

PiggyLalala  KiasuGrandMaster
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by Guest » Thu Jun 09, 2011 9:27 am
The other thing is model diagram is only a means, not the end. So while finding out his issue with problem sums, put model diagram aside. Once you know the root, model is used to assist explanation. If model is put as the main goal, and if he has a fear for models, it becomes a mental block.
If he understands algebra better, why not try that as well? There are many roads leading to Rome.
If he understands algebra better, why not try that as well? There are many roads leading to Rome.
 Guest
Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by CoffeeCat » Thu Jun 09, 2011 9:49 am
Hmm, what's his background with modelling? When was he taught modelling? Did he draw model before p4?
I won't be surprised if he happen to be a beginner. When I was first taught modelling in p4 I didn't grasp it immediately too. Maybe
his modelling foundation is just weak.
I won't be surprised if he happen to be a beginner. When I was first taught modelling in p4 I didn't grasp it immediately too. Maybe
his modelling foundation is just weak.

CoffeeCat  BrownBelt
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Re: Help with model maths for P4 child
by PiggyLalala » Thu Jun 09, 2011 2:02 pm
ksi wrote:The other thing is model diagram is only a means, not the end. So while finding out his issue with problem sums, put model diagram aside. Once you know the root, model is used to assist explanation. If model is put as the main goal, and if he has a fear for models, it becomes a mental block.
If he understands algebra better, why not try that as well? There are many roads leading to Rome.
Yup, most of the questions on ratios and percentages can be solved easily by simple algebraic equations. If a child has great difficulties in models, then the 'algrebra approach' may be a good alternative.

PiggyLalala  KiasuGrandMaster
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