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GEP screening test? Go or no Go

Poll ended at Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:26 pm

Must Go
7
35%
Can Try
11
55%
Don't Go
2
10%
 
Total votes : 20

Postby INNOVATE » Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:23 pm

With the introduction of IP, personally feel that gifted programme should be scrapped. Each year many PSLE top scorers were from main stream with a fair number from neighbourhood schools.

Anyway, top performers will have many opportunities to attend special trainings as they embark on their journey in high schools.

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Postby INNOVATE » Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:29 pm

There is no need to be disappointed if your kids could't get into the gifted programme. Personally don't understand why parents send a small fortune to have their kids enroll in special programme prior to GEP screening tests.

Is as if gifted can be trained!

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Postby naggo-nitemare » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:07 pm

INNOVATE wrote:With the introduction of IP, personally feel that gifted programme should be scrapped. Each year many PSLE top scorers were from main stream with a fair number from neighbourhood schools.

Anyway, top performers will have many opportunities to attend special trainings as they embark on their journey in high schools.


This has been discussed before a few times. PSLE is NOT a gauge of giftedness. Take for eg this yr's maths paper. Many will hv high scores because of it is relatively easy but it does not mean the high scorers are gifted in maths. If my DS were to remain in the mainstream, he would hv been bored stiff with the mainstream curriculum as the aim is to prepare the mainstream to do well in such a PSLE maths exam. In GEP, he enjoys the depth and pace of the maths curriculum.

Many mainstreamers whether from neighbourhood sch or otherwise do well in psle because they hv been preparing for this psle grand finale since p4. GEP curriculum is much more than just aiming to be 'top scorer' in PSLE , w/c tests largely exam-smartness. If PSLE is designed to be a accurate reflection of giftedness, all the exam papers will be much harder, with many twists. Straightforward qns will be a rarity if this the case.

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Postby jtoh » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:16 pm

naggo-nitemare wrote:
INNOVATE wrote:With the introduction of IP, personally feel that gifted programme should be scrapped. Each year many PSLE top scorers were from main stream with a fair number from neighbourhood schools.

Anyway, top performers will have many opportunities to attend special trainings as they embark on their journey in high schools.


This has been discussed before a few times. PSLE is NOT a gauge of giftedness. Take for eg this yr's maths paper. Many will hv high scores because of it is relatively easy but it does not mean the high scorers are gifted in maths. If my DS were to remain in the mainstream, he would hv been bored stiff with the mainstream curriculum as the aim is to prepare the mainstream to do well in such a PSLE maths exam. In GEP, he enjoys the depth and pace of the maths curriculum.

Many mainstreamers whether from neighbourhood sch or otherwise do well in psle because they hv been preparing for this psle grand finale since p4. GEP curriculum is much more than just aiming to be 'top scorer' in PSLE , w/c tests largely exam-smartness. If PSLE is designed to be a accurate reflection of giftedness, all the exam papers will be much harder, with many twists. Straightforward qns will be a rarity if this the case.


I agree. Excelling in PSLE does not mean you're intellectually gifted. The GEP curriculum does not prepare one to excel at PSLE. The aim is a lot more long term than that. It aims to develop the thinker, to delve deeper and broader into subjects which are within and out of syllabus.

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Postby jtoh » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:22 pm

Trapwithin wrote:
sakura_2009 wrote:
jtoh wrote:The numbers were revised recently. Prior to 2008, the number making it to Round 2 was 3,000. Which makes it about 7%, depending on the size of the cohort that year. Of that, about 500 make it through to GEP.

In the last couple of years they've increased the number making it to the second round to about 4000.


Just wondering why the numbers are increasing? Afterall only around 500 students will eventually make it for the GEP program right?

Am also wondering why the need for the screening test in the first place? Why not make the students take the 2nd test directly and eliminate the hassle of the screening test? Just my own thoughts coz it seems that every P3 kid I know seems to be qualified for the 2nd round :?


Do not know how true.
Apparently, MOE keep tab on those that qualified for 2nd round.
In GEP School, these group will be use to do "twinning" program with the GEP students.


Those who just missed getting into the 2nd round will be highlighted to the schools. Obviously attention and opportunities will be given to those who are 600th on the list rather than 4000th.

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Postby INNOVATE » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:40 pm

As children who are really gifted is definately much less than 500 for each cohort, so there is no need for the gifted programme to continue now that the IP is much in place. MOE could have use its resources to for other areas.

As for the validity of arguments by some in support of this programme, higher order thinking skills, maths and science olympias, A* attachment, languistic and humanities scholastic programme are all provided in high schools to cater to gifted kids.

Just take a look at President and SAF Overseas Merit Scolarships winners over the recent years and one will observe that kids from the gifted programme are not as dorminant as it used to be in the past. Surely these winners are the mose all rounded students that have emerged from pur education system rather than the GEP.

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Postby verykiasu2010 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:46 pm

lwm99 wrote:
verykiasu2010 wrote:
Trapwithin wrote:
verykiasu2010 wrote:The top 5 % of the 1st round GEP test goes into the 2nd round

Out of those in the second round, about 1/5 will make it to be the selected GEP students, hence the GEP cohort is about 1% of the overall cohort



I thought they take in 4000 kids for Round 1 and about 500 for round 2.
Considering a cohort of 40,000 kids each year .. Round 1 is 10% and Round 2 is 1%


may be you are right, 10% of round 1 ... but there is something about the the 5%

I think Trapwithin is right. The numbers are from MOE. Verykiasu, where do you get your info from when you posted?


my mistake

first round getting into second round : approx 10% of the cohort

out of which 10% of the 10% of 1st round, viz 1% of the cohort, will end up selected into the GEP

the 4% outside the top 1% made it into the High Ability Class in some GEP schools, also used for intermingle or twining

of course the % is a rounded up % number
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Postby verykiasu2010 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:48 pm

jtoh wrote:
Trapwithin wrote:
sakura_2009 wrote:
jtoh wrote:The numbers were revised recently. Prior to 2008, the number making it to Round 2 was 3,000. Which makes it about 7%, depending on the size of the cohort that year. Of that, about 500 make it through to GEP.

In the last couple of years they've increased the number making it to the second round to about 4000.


Just wondering why the numbers are increasing? Afterall only around 500 students will eventually make it for the GEP program right?

Am also wondering why the need for the screening test in the first place? Why not make the students take the 2nd test directly and eliminate the hassle of the screening test? Just my own thoughts coz it seems that every P3 kid I know seems to be qualified for the 2nd round :?


Do not know how true.
Apparently, MOE keep tab on those that qualified for 2nd round.
In GEP School, these group will be use to do "twinning" program with the GEP students.


Those who just missed getting into the 2nd round will be highlighted to the schools. Obviously attention and opportunities will be given to those who are 600th on the list rather than 4000th.


anecdotal incidents suggest so
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Postby jtoh » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:53 pm

INNOVATE wrote:As children who are really gifted is definately much less than 500 for each cohort, so there is no need for the gifted programme to continue now that the IP is much in place. MOE could have use its resources to for other areas.

As for the validity of arguments by some in support of this programme, higher order thinking skills, maths and science olympias, A* attachment, languistic and humanities scholastic programme are all provided in high schools to cater to gifted kids.

Just take a look at President and SAF Overseas Merit Scolarships winners over the recent years and one will observe that kids from the gifted programme are not as dorminant as it used to be in the past. Surely these winners are the mose all rounded students that have emerged from pur education system rather than the GEP.


How do we identify if the scholars were from GEP or not?

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Postby INNOVATE » Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:12 pm

jtoh

Just look at the secondary schools they had attended. As for the IP students, it may be difficult unless one is from the same jc.

I notice that it is the parents who are rather obessed with GEP for various reasons. So much resources are used for a small minority of pupils whose eventual performance or contributions are not easily measureable.

With even non IP schools students winning the most coveted scholarships, I am totally not convince of the merits ot GEP. Moreover, the tests in itself is depend on the actual performance of kids on those days. Whereas to win the most coveted scholarships, a student has to prove far way beyond academics, ccas chacracter, and intelligence over a prolonged. period.

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