All About Autism

Discuss issues related to children who have special needs or learning difficulties
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MrsKiasu
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Re: All About Autism

Post by MrsKiasu » Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:43 am

Zeit wrote:
MrsKiasu wrote:immeemee, make sure all devices have enough charge for photos/video taking :rahrah: And bring along tissue paper arh :lol:
Photo & video taking are strictly prohibited during SYF Arts Presentations. Gotta wait for teachers to whatsapp official videos :-)

ImMeeMee: All the best! I think Modern Dance & Band should be the last 2 items this week.
oh is it :oops: :razz:

ImMeeMee
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Re: All About Autism

Post by ImMeeMee » Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:21 pm

Thanks for the well wishes. :smile:

She has really come a long way with her resilience. I guess it's Mummy's emo getting in the way here.

I am going to savour that few minutes of performance. Enjoy myself. :smile:

Cool Cool
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Re: All About Autism

Post by Cool Cool » Sat Jun 02, 2018 5:25 pm

Hi all mummies and daddies,

May I get some suggestions from here.

My son was born in Oct 2012 and he is due to register for P1 registration for mainstream school in a few days time. He holds long term visit pass and will have to register in phase 3. So the chance of getting admission is about 50%.

Here is brief info about my son:
- He is 5 and half years old.
- Currently attending MS childcare (AM session, everyday) with ABA therapist support (2 days per week, 2 hr per day) and 3 days with my helper helping him in the class and afternoon (3 days per week, 3 hr per day) in EIP program. And weekly speech therapy.
- He still can't do conversation yet but he can express his needs (e.g., I want eat, I want juice, I want sleeping time, I want to go toilet, I want swimming, I want shower time etc.)
- He understands simple instructions only.
- Academically, he knows alphabets and numbers, knows quite a number of words and can spell. I guess his level is K1 level. He has zero knowledge of Chinese and he doesn't attend Chinese class in his childcare.

I know my son is not ready for P1 definitely. I have checked with his teachers and they also think so. My plan was to defer him for one year for P1 registration (or more if necessary). But when I inquired MOE about the deferment, their reply is that I can't defer him since he is a foreigner. I have to register this year or else sit for AEIS exam to enter the local school.

Could you please help me decide in the following options i can think of? or add on more options if you have.

1) Go ahead and register for P1 since this is the only chance he will get to go to local school other than sitting for AEIS exam. (What problems/difficulties can I face if he got the admission? Any experience to share?)
2) Send him to international school with special needs support (only 4-5 schools with annual tuition fees of about 35k.) (if we choose this option, we may not afford to send him for long term since the school fees is so high.)
3) 1-2 years in international school with supports and then transfer to private school with low annual tuition fees which we can afford long term.

Additional info - We both are PR for more than 10 years. We married here and our son was born here. Basically we settle down here already and we haven't thought about the option of going back to our country. We applied PR for him three times and got rejected. We will continue applying in future.

Thanks a lot!

zac's mum
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Re: All About Autism

Post by zac's mum » Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:13 pm

Cool Cool wrote:Hi all mummies and daddies,

May I get some suggestions from here.

My son was born in Oct 2012 and he is due to register for P1 registration for mainstream school in a few days time. He holds long term visit pass and will have to register in phase 3. So the chance of getting admission is about 50%.

Here is brief info about my son:
- He is 5 and half years old.
- Currently attending MS childcare (AM session, everyday) with ABA therapist support (2 days per week, 2 hr per day) and 3 days with my helper helping him in the class and afternoon (3 days per week, 3 hr per day) in EIP program. And weekly speech therapy.
- He still can't do conversation yet but he can express his needs (e.g., I want eat, I want juice, I want sleeping time, I want to go toilet, I want swimming, I want shower time etc.)
- He understands simple instructions only.
- Academically, he knows alphabets and numbers, knows quite a number of words and can spell. I guess his level is K1 level. He has zero knowledge of Chinese and he doesn't attend Chinese class in his childcare.

I know my son is not ready for P1 definitely. I have checked with his teachers and they also think so. My plan was to defer him for one year for P1 registration (or more if necessary). But when I inquired MOE about the deferment, their reply is that I can't defer him since he is a foreigner. I have to register this year or else sit for AEIS exam to enter the local school.

Could you please help me decide in the following options i can think of? or add on more options if you have.

1) Go ahead and register for P1 since this is the only chance he will get to go to local school other than sitting for AEIS exam. (What problems/difficulties can I face if he got the admission? Any experience to share?)
2) Send him to international school with special needs support (only 4-5 schools with annual tuition fees of about 35k.) (if we choose this option, we may not afford to send him for long term since the school fees is so high.)
3) 1-2 years in international school with supports and then transfer to private school with low annual tuition fees which we can afford long term.

Additional info - We both are PR for more than 10 years. We married here and our son was born here. Basically we settle down here already and we haven't thought about the option of going back to our country. We applied PR for him three times and got rejected. We will continue applying in future.

Thanks a lot!
You can defer. A friend of mine enquired with MOE and they told her that her child (also on long term visit pass) can enter local school up to 4 years later than his same-age peers. So probably a few years later, when he is ready, you can let him take the AEIS exam if he seems academically able. But then you have to think about his schooling in the meantime. Is his preschool offering an option for him to repeat K2 + therapy until he’s P1 ready?

An alternative is to enquire with special schools like Pathlight School? This school specializes in educating primary school age mild to moderate ASD kids. I don’t know for sure, but I believe they would allow transfer out to mainstream primary school later on, when the child is ready. https://www.pathlight.org.sg/admissions ... n-criteria

Note: although their admission page says they give priority to SC>PR>foreigners and their waitlist is long (meaning no immediate place for foreigners), you can try placing your child on the waitlist and inform them of both your backgrounds (applied for PR 3x etc). Maybe they will take that into consideration.

tyeogh
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Re: All About Autism

Post by tyeogh » Sat Jun 02, 2018 11:07 pm

Cool Cool,
You are caught in a very bad situation. No easy answers. My son is in Pathlight P2. The odds of a foreigner being admitted is very low. Even citizens have to wait >1 year. As Zac's mum suggested, you can try applying. But be cognizant it is going to be a shot in the dark. In the meantime, you have to figure out something for your son to do.

My Pathlight son attended a Foundation year at Pathlight. Meaning he deferred one year. That Foundation year was useful in giving him time to catch up. After that Foundation year, he was ready to learn P1 school topics. And he transited smoothly into P1. I think at 5.5 yrs, he had better communication skills than your son. So it may be wise to defer your son for one year too.

I have a relative whose severely autistic son attended MS primary school without deferring. After the first year, the school insisted he employ a shadow teacher to accompany his son in class as a condition to continue schooling. I think the trigger was whether the child is disruptive to others, and he was. The cost of a shadow teacher is about $2k a month. Even then, everything went over the boy's head i.e it was as good as not attending school. The boy learnt nothing. He had to repeat P2. By P3, the school eventually kicked him out. He moved to a Special Ed school (other than Pathlight). There are a few SPED schools in Sg. They may not be as popular or good as Pathlight. In the end, that child wasted the most precious years of early intervention. He is 13 now, and has the diction of your son.

Taking all the above into consideration, imho, it is better to let a child have some form of learning in an environment and pace he is comfortable with than to "force" him to learn at a level he is not capable of. Then, at least, there is some progress. What you want to avoid is a situation where he learns nothing. This will then run contrary to the concept of early intervention.

You are faced with a very difficult decision indeed.

Perhaps you may want to consider letting your son attend/repeat Nursery or K1 at a MS kindergarten if possible. Cajole, plead, beg the kindergarten. If a kindergarten refuse your son, you can try another. Fighting to let your son attend kindergarten is a much easier fight than battling MOE at primary schools. The idea is to find a pace where your son can latch on to some form of learning. Then, let him face P1 when he is ready.

I am not sure about AEIS exams and procedures for P1. Just giving view points from an aspie learning perspective.

Edit: My K1 niece visited me today. She has far better diction and communication skills than your son. She was quizzing me what are the names of the 5 oceans (really got 5??). So I am reminded of K1 pace. Editing to include Nursery level for your consideration.


Cool Cool
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Re: All About Autism

Post by Cool Cool » Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:15 pm

Hi Zac's mum and tyeogh,

Thanks for your reply. I did not expect to receive such a prompt response since this thread is not active nowadays.
Yeah. I will have to make very difficult decision. I asked my close friends who have NT kids and their response is to go ahead and apply for P1 since I only have this chance to enter government school (without passing AEIS exam) saying that my son will catch up later. When I checked with my son's ST and EIP teacher they all said that he is not ready for sure and will have a hard time in school. So I am checking here with the parents of SN kids to have parents' point of view.
I have checked with his current childcare principle about repeating K2 and she has no problem. So his schooling should be Ok in the meantime.
I have heard about AEIS exam; very difficult to pass and long waiting list of Pathlight even for Citizen children.
Tyeogh, you are right that my son's communication level is not even K1 nor 3-4 years old. That's why I am very unwilling to let him try P1. I can't imagine how he will be so lonely in school and how he can survive without understanding and communication. I can also foresee the problems will arise later and the need of shadow teacher. :(

I think I will have to decide based on my son's current condition.

tyeogh
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Re: All About Autism

Post by tyeogh » Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:29 pm

Hi Cool Cool,
That relative of mine also put his aspie child through MS P1 without deferring hoping that this son will "catch up later". I can understand why this is every aspie parent's piped dream - that his loved one will one day be normal. If your child has a confirmed diagnosis of aspergers, to me, one should to be very clear eyed when making decisions. There is no way a diagnosed aspie can miraculously "catch up". Not unless he is a savant which only 7% of aspies are according to statistics. On the contrary, aspies need their learning processes "broken down" into smaller parts. So they can learn part by part at their own pace. If your child attends EIP, you should understand what I mean. The child is capable of learning. Just at a slower pace than NT children.

Putting an aspie child who can only express simple needs like "I want water" to P1, is akin to putting a P1 NT child through university. There is no way that child will understand what is being taught. In fact, that NT P1 child has a better chance. At least he can read some words. Your child may eventually learn some life skills like going to school, toileting and coming home on the school bus. But while he is in class, he is not likely to learn anything.

Have you seen Singapore's P1's text book? The Maths is not just numbers. The child has to read English sentences to answer which is larger 7 or 9, and what is 2 more than 5. There is a reason why primary school enroll 7 year olds and not younger. They should have at least a few hundred words diction that they have learnt in K2, if not more, to understand what will be taught at P1. And we have not even mentioned Mother Tongue or Chinese. So what if he finishes P1. Then come P2, how then? He would have missed a lot of P1's learning, which will be needed for P2. And so on for P3.

What I find more detrimental is the child is trained to "ignore" everything taught in class. Since he does not understand anything. It becomes a routine not to learn. He develops a nonchalance or resistance to learning. This, to me, is the biggest set back. The child retards. As he ages.

Yes, you may secure a MS P1 slot for your child. The school fees is also not cheap for a foreigner btw. But at what immeasurable cost to your child? I do not want to be you. Sorry for being candid.

To me, the best scenario is one where a young aspie child can learn something daily. Even if he learns just 1 word a day, he would have picked up close to 400 words in a year! That's more than what us aspie parents can ask for.

slmkhoo
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Re: All About Autism

Post by slmkhoo » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:12 pm

tyeogh wrote:... There is no way a diagnosed aspie can miraculously "catch up". Not unless he is a savant which only 7% of aspies are according to statistics. On the contrary, aspies need their learning processes "broken down" into smaller parts. So they can learn part by part at their own pace. If your child attends EIP, you should understand what I mean. The child is capable of learning. Just at a slower pace than NT children.

...What I find more detrimental is the child is trained to "ignore" everything taught in class. Since he does not understand anything. It becomes a routine not to learn. He develops a nonchalance or resistance to learning. This, to me, is the biggest set back. The child retards. As he ages.
I am the mother of an aspie girl, very mild aspie. But I totally agree with the above. It's best to slow the child down rather than try to get him to "catch up" (which is impossible). What they need is time. Hurrying and pressure is counter-productive. And no, they will never be completely "normal" but can learn to minimise the differences and cope. How well they learn depends on the individual, and some will do it better than others.

Cool Cool
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Re: All About Autism

Post by Cool Cool » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:14 pm

Hi tyeogh,

Thanks for your view on this. I know my son needs more time. And I also know they can't catch up easily since I have been a parent of SN kid for more than 3 years. I have also seen his K1 and K2 work sheets (he is attending both K1 and K2 classes in MS childcare instead of attending Chinese class) and I know the high standard of Eng and Maths. That's why I want to defer him at least 1-2 year. But the Singapore education system doesn't allow me to do this. So my only choice is to go for private route.
This morning his ST teacher did language assessment and his level is that of 2.5 years old only. So this assessment result and your view and experience made my decision of not registering in phase 3 is more confirmed.
So the next step is to continue his schooling in the same childcare for next year. From there I will decide depending on his condition.

Thanks a lot for helping me in my decision making. :)

Cool Cool
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Re: All About Autism

Post by Cool Cool » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:21 pm

[quote="slmkhoo"][quote="tyeogh"]... There is no way a diagnosed aspie can miraculously "catch up". Not unless he is a savant which only 7% of aspies are according to statistics. On the contrary, aspies need their learning processes "broken down" into smaller parts. So they can learn part by part at their own pace. If your child attends EIP, you should understand what I mean. The child is capable of learning. Just at a slower pace than NT children.

Dear Slmkhoo,

Very well noted. I know these come from very experience mum and many thanks.

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