Find Tuition/Enrichment Centres

Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

General comments and chit-chat, or tell us how we can improve KiasuParents.com

Would you or won't you worry if your child were failing in P2?

Yes
70
96%
No
3
4%
 
Total votes : 73

Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby Chenonceau » Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:57 am

Reading today's Straits Times, I learn of an absurd phenomenon that I believe has its roots in number (1).

(1) Schools test way beyond what they teach.
(2) Parents enrol kids in elite tuition centres to teach the material schools test but don't teach. These centres have thus the status of 2nd Regular School since they learn stuff here that is taught nowhere else.
(3) Kids can't cope with homework given by their 2nd Regular School.
(4) Parents hire 2nd line tutors to help kids with homework from their 2nd regular school.

How did we end up here in the last 7 years? Where will this bring us? http://www.straitstimes.com/STForum/Sto ... 65952.html

Chenonceau
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:57 pm
Total Likes: 19


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby psle2011mum » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:25 am

GEP brings S3 level down to P6; HAKs can quite easily cope with Sec 1 & 2 Math [ ie boderline A1s] using their P6 knowledge- that's my gut feel about where the 'above cognitive level testing" in primary school hits.

I doubt the powers that be want to change PSLE from a Differentiation game to a means of testing adequate ability for the next stage of school, so it is important parents bear this in mind when their child is "labelled" by the system.

DD is the tortoise not the hare -- she used her diligence and average intelligence to make the grade but this meant that (a) she had to work very hard on her own and (b) she needed better guidance [someone who understood her and addressed her weaknesses directly] and resources than what the system could afford to let her have.

Things are a lot more "sane" in secondary school; resources are better [ ie suitable for self-learning]; kids too have not much time for tuition as they cope with long school hours plus CCA , so my feel is that the "above cognitive level" testing in secondary school is probably not as high. That said, this is the DDs' school and I'm not sure whether this sanity prevails in other secondary schools.

Possibly not because I do recall that in my experience with a brand name JC with a lot of SAP overtones [this is not a generalisation but merely an accurate description of the JC I attended], my classmates (who must have pitied my extremely poor math performance) actually whispered to me - " Eh-- you cannot just do the work the tutor sets ok ? Sure fail one -- they set 1st year university math questions for exams - you donch know uh..." :yikes:

I really did not do well in those 2 JC years but God was good and I scrapped through and found a place in my faculty of choice. The uni days were far more similar to what I was used to - self learning, thinking more than doing, depth versus breath, so the kids with the top scores didn't necessarily do well because there was no way humanly possible to cover all that content by going through it [ and anyway, that wasn't the point].

Till the day we test at the child's cognitive level and not beyond, till the day we have better resources and teachers who are left to teach and not loaded with unrealistic KPIs, till the day the system becomes child centric , it is for us parents to breathe sanity into this crazy system that has led to second tier tutors supporting the first tier ones that support the school teachers :siao:

psle2011mum
GreenBelt
GreenBelt
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:52 pm
Total Likes: 2


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby Chenonceau » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:35 am

psle2011mum wrote:GEP brings S3 level down to P6; HAKs can quite easily cope with Sec 1 & 2 Math [ ie boderline A1s] using their P6 knowledge- that's my gut feel about where the 'above cognitive level testing" in primary school hits.

I doubt the powers that be want to change PSLE from a Differentiation game to a means of testing adequate ability for the next stage of school, so it is important parents bear this in mind when their child is "labelled" by the system.


Yes... must have a dose of scepticism when schools label your child in any way. Trust your Mommy/Daddy instincts.

psle2011mum wrote:DD is the tortoise not the hare -- she used her diligence and average intelligence to make the grade but this meant that (a) she had to work very hard on her own and (b) she needed better guidance [someone who understood her and addressed her weaknesses directly] and resources than what the system could afford to let her have.


This sounds like my DS. Average child who has to work hard on his own and needs better guidance from me who understands him and can address his weaknesses directly PLUS more resources than what his school gives.

psle2011mum wrote:Things are a lot more "sane" in secondary school; resources are better [ ie suitable for self-learning]; kids too have not much time for tuition as they cope with long school hours plus CCA , so my feel is that the "above cognitive level" testing in secondary school is probably not as high. That said, this is the DDs' school and I'm not sure whether this sanity prevails in other secondary schools.

Possibly not because I do recall that in my experience with a brand name JC with a lot of SAP overtones [this is not a generalisation but merely an accurate description of the JC I attended], my classmates (who must have pitied my extremely poor math performance) actually whispered to me - " Eh-- you cannot just do the work the tutor sets ok ? Sure fail one -- they set 1st year university math questions for exams - you donch know uh..." :yikes:


We are seriously considering 2nd tier schools.

psle2011mum wrote:I really did not do well in those 2 JC years but God was good and I scrapped through and found a place in my faculty of choice. The uni days were far more similar to what I was used to - self learning, thinking more than doing, depth versus breath, so the kids with the top scores didn't necessarily do well because there was no way humanly possible to cover all that content by going through it [ and anyway, that wasn't the point].


It seems that JC losers like you and I did not have our critical thinking educated right out of us.

psle2011mum wrote:Till the day we test at the child's cognitive level and not beyond, till the day we have better resources and teachers who are left to teach and not loaded with unrealistic KPIs, till the day the system becomes child centric , it is for us parents to breathe sanity into this crazy system that has led to second tier tutors to support the first tier ones that support the school teachers :siao:


Yes... we will have to support each other and encourage each other and uplift each other... and our kids.

Chenonceau
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:57 pm
Total Likes: 19


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby janet88 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:45 am

psle2011mum wrote:Things are a lot more "sane" in secondary school; resources are better [ ie suitable for self-learning]; kids too have not much time for tuition as they cope with long school hours plus CCA , so my feel is that the "above cognitive level" testing in secondary school is probably not as high. That said, this is the DDs' school and I'm not sure whether this sanity prevails in other secondary schools.

My son is in P6...friends tell me school hours in secondary school are very long and CCA is compulsory. So basically there is NO time for tuition. A friend's son is in Sec 1 this year...she told me her son is kept busy with CCA and early day home is 3pm once a week...she has to be the tutor now or else her poor son cannot sleep.

Till the day we test at the child's cognitive level and not beyond, till the day we have better resources and teachers who are left to teach and not loaded with unrealistic KPIs, till the day the system becomes child centric , it is for us parents to breathe sanity into this crazy system that has led to second tier tutors to support the first tier ones that support the school teachers :siao:


Is it possible at all to make learning fun in primary school ? My daughter is in P2 this year. I read yesterday's ST about parents sending their 8 year olds to see psychologists after little ones flunked mid-year Math.
It doesn't mean that ALL P2 kids attend enrichment classes to allow teachers in school teach more difficult stuff.

In Oct this year, my daughter, like many other P2s will have SA2. This will mean streaming. After the officer's assessment that she is on the slow side bcos her cognitive understanding is not of an 8 year old, I am taking one day at a time. I don't want her to see a psychologist or psychiatrist :yikes: . Meanwhile, I am coaching her personally and planning her revision every morning. Wish me luck.

janet88
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 39758
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:37 am
Total Likes: 125


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby Chenonceau » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:47 am

janet_lee88 wrote:
psle2011mum wrote:Things are a lot more "sane" in secondary school; resources are better [ ie suitable for self-learning]; kids too have not much time for tuition as they cope with long school hours plus CCA , so my feel is that the "above cognitive level" testing in secondary school is probably not as high. That said, this is the DDs' school and I'm not sure whether this sanity prevails in other secondary schools.

My son is in P6...friends tell me school hours in secondary school are very long and CCA is compulsory. So basically there is NO time for tuition. A friend's son is in Sec 1 this year...she told me her son is kept busy with CCA and early day home is 3pm once a week...she has to be the tutor now or else her poor son cannot sleep.

Till the day we test at the child's cognitive level and not beyond, till the day we have better resources and teachers who are left to teach and not loaded with unrealistic KPIs, till the day the system becomes child centric , it is for us parents to breathe sanity into this crazy system that has led to second tier tutors to support the first tier ones that support the school teachers :siao:


Is it possible at all to make learning fun in primary school ? My daughter is in P2 this year. I read yesterday's ST about parents sending their 8 year olds to see psychologists after little ones flunked mid-year Math.
It doesn't mean that ALL P2 kids attend enrichment classes to allow teachers in school teach more difficult stuff.

In Oct this year, my daughter, like many other P2s will have SA2. This will mean streaming. After the officer's assessment that she is on the slow side bcos her cognitive understanding is not of an 8 year old, I am taking one day at a time. I don't want her to see a psychologist or psychiatrist :yikes: . Meanwhile, I am coaching her personally and planning her revision every morning. Wish me luck.


Good luck!!

Chenonceau
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:57 pm
Total Likes: 19



Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby janet88 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:49 am

Hi Chenonceau,
Thank you.

I hope I am doing the right thing. :xedfingers:

janet88
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 39758
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:37 am
Total Likes: 125


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby psle2011mum » Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:00 am

Labelling -- if I had believed all the labels others sought to stick me with, I'd be a timid, socially challenged JC dropout.


I was terribly crushed in JC when every week's AT showed a single digit score - regardless of whether it was out of 50 or 100. Self doubt crept in. The Civics Tutor [aka Form Teacher] pulled me out, asked me what I wanted to do in life and laughed when I replied. I did not fit in that school, and if you just looked at my grades and academic performance then, I wasn't going to make it to uni even.

I read with concern how kids/parents are told by schools/teachers that their kids are "slow", "under achieving", "not making the grade", " not keeping up with the rest of the class". True, some kids do have pre-existing issues but I do think a whole bunch of them are nowhere underperforming but are likely to be crushed by the labelling.

Trust your parental instincts, you know your child best -- be less ready to accept the labels given by the system and look at your child instead. If the label doesn't gel with what you know about your child, be free to reject it and as they said in WWII - "Keep calm and carry on " :smile:

“If you bungle raising your children, I don't think whatever else you do well matters very much.” -Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis

psle2011mum
GreenBelt
GreenBelt
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:52 pm
Total Likes: 2


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby psle2011mum » Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:14 am

janet_lee88

You are doing the right thing -- you are looking at your daughter as an individual and you are supporting her directly, addressing her needs - emotional, academic, character- building. You are showing her that inspite of what the system says, she has the ability to cope, thrive and blossom - she just needs to achieve this in her own way and not the system's way. She is very blessed indeed to have you alongside.

According to aerodynamic laws, the bumblebee cannot fly. Its body weight is not the right proportion to its wingspan. Ignoring these laws, the bee flies anyway. – M. Sainte-Lague

psle2011mum
GreenBelt
GreenBelt
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:52 pm
Total Likes: 2


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby janet88 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:14 am

psle2011mum wrote:I read with concern how kids/parents are told by schools/teachers that their kids are "slow", "under achieving", "not making the grade", " not keeping up with the rest of the class". True, some kids do have pre-existing issues but I do think a whole bunch of them are nowhere underperforming but are likely to be crushed by the labelling.

Trust your parental instincts, you know your child best -- be less ready to accept the labels given by the system and look at your child instead. If the label doesn't gel with what you know about your child, be free to reject it and as they said in WWII - "Keep calm and carry on " :smile:


Sad to say, the kids in today's context are forced to perform and excel. Teachers in some schools are not able to dedicate time to help kids pass even at P1/2 where class size is kept to 30. So that's why parents look to enrichment centres for kids to learn more so that when teachers ask questions in school, they know how to reply. Teachers get the impression that the kids are above standard and thus teach faster.

A half page ad in yest's ST featured 2 top PSLE students about their beliefs in a particular enrichment centre they (and their siblings attend).
This centre only features top PSLE students...shouldn't they focus on weaker students to TRULY boost its capability to groom ?

janet88
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 39758
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:37 am
Total Likes: 125


Re: Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

Postby Chenonceau » Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:18 am

psle2011mum wrote:According to aerodynamic laws, the bumblebee cannot fly. Its body weight is not the right proportion to its wingspan. Ignoring these laws, the bee flies anyway. – M. Sainte-Lague


Yes... Janet... you love your child. We can all see that. You're alongside her and with her. That can't go wrong. Only... don't take labels in blind faith. I too was labelled stupid. My son was also described like this once. No... not average... but really described as "slow". If you're not dumb and your hubby isn't, why should your DD be?

You might have a DD bumblebee to love and cherish.

Chenonceau
KiasuGrandMaster
KiasuGrandMaster
 
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:57 pm
Total Likes: 19


PreviousNext

Return to Recess Time

Find Tuition/Enrichment Centres